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v.11 - Twice now Jehoshaphat has sought a prophet of the Lord (here and 1Kings 22:7). It is a sad fact that other prophets (it seemed) were in some abundance, but the prophet of the Lord had to be sought out. Nevertheless we find this still to ring true. Wordily wisdom (which is foolishness with God) is available - and more and more so as our communications networks go from strength to strength, but the Godly wisdom that we desire is found only through self-denial and much heartache. 1Cor.3:19 James 1:2-5
Peter [UK] Comment added in 2001 Reply to Peter
v.2-3 This testimony indicates that outward appearance is not sufficient. A man is what he thinks Proverbs 23:7. Jehoram gave an outward show but his heart was still far from God. The lesson for us that our live must be 'transformed' Romans 12:1 both in the way that we think Philippians 2:5 and by our actions James 1:22
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2001 Reply to Peter
v.2 - We see here that there are degrees of idolatry, but that all degrees are evil. Just because we don't have idols does not mean that we have conquered covetousness, which Paul tells us is idolatry (Col.3:5)
Peter [UK] Comment added in 2002 Reply to Peter
:7 That Jehoram was able to tell Jehoshaphat that his 'horses' were many tells us, almost incidentally, that he had forsaken the commandment (Deuteronomy 17:16) give to Israel.
:25 In telling us that he 'felled all the good trees' again we see a violation of the law - Deuteronomy 20:19 though they were told by God to 'fell every good tree' (2Kin 3:19) How do we resolve this seeming contradiction?
Brother Michael Parry has made the following suggestion.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2002 Reply to Peter
:16-24 So Israel waited in the camp and their enemies came, thinking that they would be able to spoil the camp - and were defeated. However Israel had to just stand and wait for their enemies to come - that they might realise that the deliverance was of God.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2003 Reply to Peter
REACTION TO TROUBLE
It had been a whole week that the kings of Israel, Judah and Edom had been tramping through the desert. Now they discovered that they had run out of water and were defenceless against the armies of Moab. The reactions of the king of Israel and the king of Judah can be very typical of our response when we are caught in similar situations.
The reaction of Joram, king of Israel was to instantly turn and blame the LORD for the situation they were in - although it was not as if they had asked the advice of the LORD in the first place. "What!" exclaimed the king of Israel. "Has the LORD called us three kings together only to hand us over to Moab?" (2 Kings 3 v 10) When things don't go as well as we expect they should, do we blame God as our first port of call even though we did not seek his advice earlier?
Jehosophat, the king of Judah, had a more noble reaction. Seeing no way out of his predicament, he turned to the LORD. "Is there no prophet of the LORD here, that we may enquire of the LORD through him?" he asked. (2 Kings 3 v 8) Why did he wait until he could go no further before asking for the LORD's advice? Do we?
Let's not blame God for our problems or use him as a last resort, but seek his guidance first, getting him to show us the right way.
Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)] Comment added in 2003 Reply to Robert
3:2 Here we have some additional information about Ahab. 1Kin 16:31 tells us the he worshipped Baal and made an altar. Here we learn that he made an image also.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to Peter
V.2-3 It is true that at the start of this chapter Jehoram is credited with putting away the image of Baal that Ahab had made; but the overall description of him is that he was evil, and that he followed in the ways of Jeroboam the son of Nebat.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to John
Today's chapter speaks of 3 kings coming to Elisha's door. What an honour! 3 Kings coming to seek his advice! Now for the "type": the water which brought salvation to the kings, brought death to the enemy.
Does this teach of the water of baptism, and of the judgement of the Lord when He returns?
David Simpson [Worcester (UK)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to David
V.6 Jehoram made a levy from his own subjects, and at the same time sought an alliance with Jehosophat, which, as on the former occasion between his father Ahab and Jehosophat was readily promised(1Kin22:4)
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)] Comment added in 2005 Reply to John
Vs.19,25 The felling of the good trees might seem, at first glance, to be contrary to the Law (Deut 20:19). However, on closer examination, we see that there is no contradiction.
The prohibition under the Law to cutting down good trees only applied in laying siege to a city. Trees that bear fruit had to be preserved while others could be cut down to help in the siege (Deut 20:20).
The idea of laying siege to a city was to ultimately force the residents of the city to yield and give up the city to the attackers. The city would not be destroyed but occupied by the new tenants. Thus, the good trees had to be preserved for the continuation of city life.
However, the Moabite cities were not laid to siege for their continuance, but were utterly destroyed. And so, the destruction of everything, including the good trees, was appropriate.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2005 Reply to Michael
3:14 Jehoshaphat must have been brought up with a start when he heard the words of the prophet. He was compromised by association with Jehoram – doubtless because of the marriage between his son and the house of Ahab.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2006 Reply to Peter
3:1 The identification of the overlap between Ahab and Jehoshaphat should alert us to the fact that this overlap will highlight some connections between the two kings. All the kings overlapped right up to the end of Hoshea’s reign in Samaria but the overlap is rarely mentioned. We are being invited to think about the overlap so we should be looking, in the narrative, for points of contact.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to Peter
Jehoram was a man who made no mark in the history of his kingdom, and whose life was characterised only by his lack of faith in the God of Israel. He was not unlike other kings of Israel who cleave to the sins of Jeroboam.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to John
Vs.7,9 Joram called upon Jehoshaphat to help him put down the rebellious king of Moab. Jehoshaphat agreed and also brought along the king of Edom. There were friendly ties between Judah and Israel, at this time. Jehoshaphat's son, Jehoram, married Ahab's daughter Athaliah (Joram's sister). Judah had dominance over Edom, but, as we will see later, in Ch. 8, Edom successfully rebelled against Judah and gained its independence.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to Michael
3:11 So Jehoshaphat tries to bring a Scriptural approach to the problem – however he is fighting a losing battle. He would have done better not to be there at all.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2008 Reply to Peter
V.15 Elisha was very upset at the presence of the three kings. An agitated mind is not conducive to addressing Yahweh. And so, Elisha called for a musician to help him calm down. Remember, this is how David was able to calm Saul down from his dark moods (1Sam 16:23).
Yahweh had given Elijah a lesson as to how He addressed His people. It was not in a state of tumult, but in calm (1Kin 19:12). If we are upset, then let us not approach Yahweh until we have calmed down. This is proper.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2008 Reply to Michael
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Peter
Vs.:2,3 Although Jehoram stopped Baal worship, worship of the golden calves that Jeroboam had set up in Dan and Bethel, continued.
V.6 Under the law, when numbering occurred, a tax would also have been collected (Exo 30:12,13).
V.9 Although Edom had been subdued and incorporated into Israel it would later rebel. This traditional enemy of Israel would go on to help Nebuchadnezzar against Judah.
V.22 The low, red sun on the eastern horizon, reflected off the ditches of water, which appeared to the Moabites as blood.
V.27 For the Moabites, the battle had been lost. The king of Moab was trapped. In desperation and anger, he did that which was abhorrent to the Israelites under the Law. He sacrificed his son to Chemosh (the Moabite equivalent to the Ammonite god Molech) (Lev 18:21). The Israelites were horrified by this act, and withdrew from the battleground.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Michael
3:7 Yet again the king of Israel calls for Jehoshaphat to assist him in battle. Ahab and Ahaziah had both done so and now Jehoram does the same.
The house of Israel and the house of Judah were now connected by marriage
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2010 Reply to Peter
2Kin 3:9,11 - lack of water may hint a spiritual drought of the word - they should have enquired of God initially.
2Kin 3:10,13 - Jehoram had no faith in God that he would be delivered from Moab.
2Kin 3:20,22,23,24 - V.20 mentions sacrifice and in the following verses we have mention of water with an appearance of blood which led to salvation for some and death for the enemy (sin?) - see David Simpson's 2004 comments. We recall when Christ was pierced in his side blood and water poured out (John 19:34).
2Kin 3:19,25,27 - God's instructions to overthrow every city of Moab were not carried out and we have a sacrifice of a firstborn son (death of sinful nature?).
Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)] Comment added in 2010 Reply to Charles
3:27 Maybe the king of Moab drew upon the example of Abraham offering Isaac as the basis for his actions. However there were significant differences. Abraham was called upon to offer Isaac, the king of Moab was not. Abraham was a faithful servant of God, the king of Moab was not. Abraham was being tested, the king of Moab was trying to appease his god.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2011 Reply to Peter
Wes Booker [South Austin Texas USA] Comment added in 2012 Reply to Wes
3:6-7 Did Jehoram, after numbering Israel, realise that he had insufficient fighting men to go against Moab and rather than seek God’s assistance went to the king of Judah?
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2012 Reply to Peter
3:11 in speaking of pouring water on the hands of Elijah the king is speaking of events recorded in 1Kin 19:21. It was the work of the servant.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2013 Reply to Peter
In 2Kin 3:25 we see that Kir Haraseth alone was left standing. The city must have recovered from this onslaught, because in Isa 16:7,11 and Jer 48:31,36 prophecies are again written against the city.
Rob de Jongh [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2013 Reply to Rob
3:9 Repeatedly in this chapter we read of “the king of Israel” and he is not named whereas the king of Judah is always named. It is as if the king of Israel is of little consequence, maybe because he has turned away from God.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2014 Reply to Peter
3:16 God was going to save the people. However He required them to do something. God could have saved them without them having to dig ditches. Likewise He will provide for us but this does not mean that we can sit around and do nothing.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2015 Reply to Peter
3:14 The fact that Elisha took account of the presence of Jehoshaphat indicates that God will intervene on behalf of His servants even though He has no regard for others with him. We should take comfort in this.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2016 Reply to Peter
v27 This passage and the suggested explanations have never satisfied me. While the commentators all seem to agree that the Chemosh worshipping Moabite king (history seems to support his fanaticism for Chemosh) sacrificed his son and as a result Israel withdrew. The view that in anyway God would grant unto the king of Moab success in this matter does not make sense. Josephus in his Antiquities of the Jews agress that the kiong of Moab sacrficed his son, but believed that the attacking kings felt sorry for the king of Moab and withdrew, so it does not explain the phrase there was indignation against Israel. An alternative might be this, that it was not the son of the king of Moab that was sacrificed, but the son of the King of Edom, who may have been captured in the failed attempt to attack the king of Edom was the one that the king of Moab sacrificed, resulting in the Edomites becoming angry with Israel for pusing the Moabites to do this. The passage does not say that God was angry but that their was indignation against Israel. This could have been a breakup of the alliance resulting in a withdrawal of the troops.
Alex Browning [Kitchener-Waterloo] Comment added in 2016 Reply to Alex
3:3 In saying that Jehoram “cleaved” <1692> to the sins of his father the holy spirit uses the same word which we find in 2:24. It was not a casual association. Rather it was total commitment to false worship.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2017 Reply to Peter
3:2 Whilst there different degrees of waywardness any waywardness is “evil” for whilst Jehoram removed the images his father, and by implication, his mother had made.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2018 Reply to Peter
3:25 the act of putting stones in the land was part of the process of making the land difficult to cultivate. Likewise stopping the wells would make it difficult to water the land.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Peter
3:5 The death of Ahab may well have caused a period of uncertainty about the state of the kingdom of Israel. It may well have been that Mesha, king od Moab, thought it was worth a try to escape from the tribute he had paid to Ahab.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2020 Reply to Peter
3:18 The kings of Israel and Judah should have realised that nothing was too hard for Yahweh. Jehoshaphat clearly knew that but the king of Israel would not appreciate it. It raises the question again as to whether Jehoshaphat should really have been there.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2021 Reply to Peter
3:3 “which made Israel to sin” - a recurring phrase in the days of the kings of Israel in Samaria – is an indication that we should heed. It is possible to lead our fellow believers astray from right beliefs and actions by the way we live ourselves.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2022 Reply to Peter
3:2 A marriage “in the Lord” should be an environment where godly characters are developed. A relationship where godly principles are taught. With Ahab and jezebel this was not so. The fault started when Ahab took a wife who was not of the daughters of Israel. The downhill spiral that Ahab went on was an inevitable consequence of his foolish choice – though at the time it would have seemed wise to seek alliance with a powerful nation “next door”.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Peter
4:8 the fact that the “great woman” constrained Elisha would indicate that his initial response was to decline the offer of accommodation with her and her husband. There is a clear lesson for us. We should not assume that when help is declined that there is no real need. We should not be deterred from offering help just because of a rebuttal.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Peter
v2 He [Jehoram] put away the pillar of Baal that his father had made.
This may have been an astute political move rather than any reform by Jehoram. Jezebel would have been upset by Jehoram's destruction of an icon to Baal. But Jehoram needed to court the favour of Jehoshaphat. In asking for Jehoshaphat's help against the Moabites, Jehoram may have said something like: "Could you help me, and you know that I have put away some of my dad's excesses". Jehoshaphat would feel a need to help a person who is making a start on religious reform. Sadly, Jehoshaphat was duped.
Jehoshaphat hastily entered into an alliance (v7) and it seems did not consult God. Had Jehoshaphat consulted God early on, he would have been warned of entering into an alliance with Jehoram.
Bruce Bates [Forbes Australia] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Bruce
v8 By the way of the wilderness of Edom
This was a very circuitous route. Moab would be preparing for an attack from Israel from the west not the south, especially that the south was barren. By going via Edom, Edom's support would be properly enlisted for the attack, and Israel would have the element of surprise against Moab. Also, the logistics of this route, while stretched, depended on the truthfulness of one assumption: the wadi that bordered Moab from Edom had never dried up. So if the armies could just get to this wadi everything would be okay. Yet this wadi, which had never dried up even under dry conditions, had dried up!! Israel, Judah and Edom were stranded.
Bruce Bates [Forbes Australia] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Bruce
v10 Alas the LORD has called these three kings to give them into the hand of Moab
When things go wrong, Jehoram blames God, not Baal (cp v13). I suspect that Jezebel had brainwashed her children at the dinner table - when things go wrong, blame Israel's God, when things go okay, thank Baal. Hence Elisha's cynical response to Jehoram in v13 "Go to the prophets of your father and to the prophets of your mother [for help]".
It is interesting that Elisha appears out of the blue such a long way from Jezreel. Maybe God warned him to travel incognito with Israel to this barren place so that God could rescue the situation - because of the integrity of Jehoshaphat (v14).
Notice also that when things go wrong our true character is revealed - Jehoram was an angry God-blaming fool; Jehoshaphat calmly sought God for help.
Bruce Bates [Forbes Australia] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Bruce
Bruce Bates [Forbes Australia] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Bruce
3:9 What a partnership! Israel and Judah and also the king of Edom – all of them to fight against a family member (Moab).
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2024 Reply to Peter
v.2 The word for fanners (zuwr <02114>) is normally translated strange or stranger. Here are a selection of the 76 occurrences - Exo.29:33 Lev 10:1 (strange fire) 2Kings 19:24 (strange waters) Psa.54:3 Jer 18:14 (that come from another place) Eze.14:5 (estranged). The stark contrast between the man in Christ and the man who exercises his free will not to accept this position is emphasised throughout scripture by the use of this word.
Peter [UK] Comment added in 2001 Reply to Peter
v.50 In speaking of letting Jerusalem come into the mind Jeremiah is reminding the people of what Solomon said. [ 1 Kings 8:30,35,42,44,48 2 Chronicles 6:26,34,38]The faithful prophet Daniel [Daniel 6:10] took Solomon and Jeremiah's word to heart.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2001 Reply to Peter
v.5 gives us an insight into the wonderful forgiveness of our God, without which we would be without hope.
Peter [UK] Comment added in 2002 Reply to Peter
51:37 That Babylon ceased to be known as a city until recent excavations proved that the city and Nebuchadnezzar existed shows that these words were actually fulfilled. The detail and finality of the prophecies confirms that this is indeed the word of God.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2002 Reply to Peter
:33-34 Whilst Babylon were a powerful oppressor they were no match for Yahweh. He is the one who is 'strong' . Israel had to understand that they were taken to Babylon, not because Yahweh was weak but because He was strong and they were weak and in need of correction. He, being strong, would eventually deliver them also.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2003 Reply to Peter
YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED
This chapter and chapter 50 contains some dreadful prophecies that speak of the total destruction of Babylon. They were given by Jeremiah just as the Babylonian empire was reaching the peak of its glory. Once Jeremiah had written it all down on a scroll he told Seraiah to take it and read it to the people of Babylon. Whether they chose to take the warnings seriously and listen to them or not was up to them - but they had been warned and when it happened they would know it was from the LORD.
In another part of the Bible we are told that God will do nothing without revealing it to his servants first. (Amos 3 v 7). So God has put his plan in the Bible. It is written in black and white, in words we can understand and there for us to see. In the Bible God warns us of the punishments that are about to come on the wicked and on us if we choose not to serve him. He also tells us of a brilliant future in the kingdom that is in store for us if we choose to live for God now. It is all written there in the Bible as an advance warning for you and me. You have been warned. Take God's warning seriously.
Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)] Comment added in 2003 Reply to Robert
51 The fall of Babylon forms the basis for much of the language in Revelation
Jer 51
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Language
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Revelation
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Golden cup
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make all the earth drunk
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Babylon is fallen
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Judgment reacheth unto heaven |
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that dwellest upon many waters
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and will make thee a burnt mountain
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Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to Peter
V.45-53 Judgement and its effects. God's people should now be sojourners in this city which was doomed. Unattached, they could disregard rumour and unrest, the rise and fall of Nebuchadnezzar's successors.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to John
READY TO LEAVE?
When the Babylonians first attacked Jerusalem and carried away captives, Jeremiah wrote to the exiles and told them, "Build houses and settle down; plant gardens and eat what they produce. Marry and have sons and daughters; find wives for your sons and give your daughters in marriage, so that they too may have sons and daughters." (Jer 29:5-6) In other words the captives were to settle down in their new land and make the most of being there. Jeremiah also told them that the captivity was to last seventy years and at the end of it they would be able to return home to Israel.
What we read in Jeremiah 51 is quite different. Here the call comes for God's people to flee from Babylon. "Flee from Babylon! Run for your lives! Do not be destroyed because of her sins. It is time for the Lord's vengeance; he will pay her what she deserves." (Jer 51:6)
Their stay in Babylon was only temporary. They had to live in her but not become so attached that they would never leave. God expected them to live in Babylon but not to be part of it - especially when it came to its wickedness. This reminds us of what John says, "Do not love the world or anything in the world." (1John 2:15) If we love the things of the world we will find it hard to come out of Babylon when we are called. The call will come. As Babylon is finally about to be destroyed toward the end of the book of Revelation, we read, "Come out of her my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues." (Rev 18:4)
Are we ready to leave everything for Christ?
Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)] Comment added in 2005 Reply to Robert
Vs.59-61 We very often associate the warnings against Babylon with prophets such as Daniel (who went to Babylon with the first wave of captives); and Ezekiel (who was likely in Babylon). Indeed, Daniel was there to interpret Babylon's and Belshazzar's downfall when the writing was, literally, on the wall (Dan 5:24-31).
However, we must not forget that the writings of Jeremiah also went to Babylon to instruct the Jews what was to happen. Daniel, himself, was instructed by the words of Jeremiah (Dan 9:2). And, here, we have just read that Seraiah (the chief priest Jer 52:24) was charged to read Jeremiah's words concerning the destruction of Babylon to the Babylonian captives.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2005 Reply to Michael
Today we have another chapter about the eventual fall of Babylon. God tells the Jews here (Jer 51:8-13), that not only will the capture of Babylon give God’s people their freedom to return to the Promised Land, but also that it will be the Medes who take Babylon. What a great prophecy!
David Simpson [Worcester (UK)] Comment added in 2005 Reply to David
51:37 In the overthrow and destruction of Babylon we see a reversal of Jerusalem’s fate – Jer 9:11. Babylon, the oppressor, now suffers the fate of the city she oppressed.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2006 Reply to Peter
V.6 The warning to Israel to flee from Babylon, lest they should be involved in the punishment of her iniquity. The exhortation for spiritual Israel is still the same in the 21st century, as we await our future king's return. "Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not her plagues" Rev 18:4
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)] Comment added in 2006 Reply to John
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to Peter
Hebrew prophecy often has double applications. The Babylon of Jeremiah's time is mirrored by a Babylonian system of idolatrous worship found in the end times. The Medo-Persian Empire destroyed the first Babylon. The second Babylon will be destroyed by Jesus when He returns to earth. Look at a few of the parallels: v.7 cf. Rev 17:2; 18:3; v.8 cf. Rev 14:8.
V.45 The Jews were urged to flee Babylon. We are urged to do the same thing (Rev 18:4). We should vigorously avoid any association with the present-day Babylon and its false beliefs and practices.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to Michael
51:25 The ‘burnt mountain’ motif is picked up in Rev 8:8 to speak of the overthrow of Babylon spoken of there.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2008 Reply to Peter
Vs.7,8 These verses are mirrored in Rev 14:8;17:4;18:2,9, amongst other verses. The first application considers physical Babylon, which was conquered by Cyrus. The second application concerns spiritual Babylon, the apostate church, which will be conquered by Jesus when he returns to earth.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2008 Reply to Michael
51:42 In speaking of the covering of Babylon with ‘the multitude of the waves’ we see the destruction of Babylon being likened to the destruction of Egypt when Israel were delivered under Moses – Exo 15:10
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Peter
V.2 The use of fanners (KJV); winnowers (ESV) employs the metaphor of the Medes as farmers who will separate the wheat from the chaff at harvest time. Babylon is considered the chaff (Psa 1:4).
V.6 Likewise, Jesus’ people are told to flee spiritual Babylon, the apostate system of worship (Rev 18:4).
V.13 The great whore of Babylon sits on many waters also. The phrase, many waters is synonymous with many people.
According to Wikipedia on the Roman Catholic Church, Church membership in 2007 was 1.147 billion people. The Catholic population increase of 139% outpaced the world population increase of 117% between 1950 and 2000.
V.16 When Jesus returns, there will physical and political changes that will take place on a magnitude not seen before. Jesus will forcefully eradicate all ungodliness, which includes spiritual Babylon (Rev 16:18).
Vs.20-23 Compare this with the role of Jesus in the latter days (Psa 2:7-9).
Vs.25,26 Babylon would be made desolate, never again to be inhabited (vs.37,62; Isa 13:19-22). The same treatment will apply to spiritual Babylon (Rome) in the end times (Rev 18:10,19).
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Michael
v41, in referring to Babylon as Sheshach, is referring us to the other time Jeremiah uses that code name. It's like when your wife only calls you "Jonathan" when she's angry with you, and "Jon" the rest of the time. You know exactly what that form of the name means to you. So also here, we know Jeremiah wants us to link this passage with Jer 25:26.
Here in 25:17-27 is a long list of the nations that would be made desolate by the judgements God would bring upon them. It starts with Jerusalem in v18 as an example. Then all the middle eastern nations in v19-25, followed by the "kings of the north" and finally "all the kingdoms of the world which are on the face of the earth" (v26). After that, Babylon would be judged as a final act: "the king of Sheshach shall drink after them". This prophecy was fulfilled by Babylon's military exploits at the time of Jeremiah and Daniel. But did Babylon's sword really reach all the kingdoms of the world? As has already been mentioned, there are many links between this chapter and Revelation. So are we to see a repeat, and complete fulfilment of this pattern of judgements in the near future?
Rob de Jongh [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Rob
51:20 In presenting Judah as the one who ‘will break in pieces the nations’ we see Jeremiah using the words of Psa 2:9 which speaks of the work of Jesus at his return to associate redeemed Israel with that work.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2010 Reply to Peter
51:49 In speaking of Babylon causing the slain of Israel to fall we see language which is later used – Rev 18:24 – when speaking of the consequences of the overthrow of the latter day Babylon.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2011 Reply to Peter
51:63 The way in which Babylon will be a ‘stone’ cast into the middle of the Euphrates echoes Moses Words – Exo 15:5- when he rejoices over the destruction of the Egyptian host in the Red Sea.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2012 Reply to Peter
51:15 The repeated appeal to the fact that God is the creator of everything contrasts with the gods of Babylon who make no such claims. It is the fact that God is the creator which provides the assurance that He will keep His word. If we cannot accept that God created everything as described in Genesis 1 one of the bases for our confidence in His future activity is removed.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2013 Reply to Peter
51:5 Israel had gone into captivity, taken by the Assyrians in Hoshea’s days. Judah was not in Israel. Judah might have been forgiven for thinking that God had forsaken them. However the words of comfort allay such feelings.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2014 Reply to Peter
51:28 The mention of the Medes here and the “wind” of judgment in verse :1 show Jeremiah re-presenting the warning that Isaiah had spoken against Babylon. Isa 13:1 speaks of a “burden” which was to be seen in the “strong wind” and the Medes are mentioned by name by Isaiah in IIsa 13:17
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2015 Reply to Peter
51:1 Jeremiah’s prophecy against Babylon is the time that an earlier prophet was talking – Isa 13:13 – who spoke of the overthrow of Babylon even before the Assyrians became a world power.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2016 Reply to Peter
51:4 The Chaldeans were not going to die in a battle where they were fighting another nation for supremacy. Jeremiah is clear. They were to be killed in their own land. This is exactly what happened when Cyrus took the city.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2017 Reply to Peter
51:2 God was going to “fan” Babylon. The prophet has spoken earlier – 15:7 – that Judah would be fanned by the Chaldeans So finally God is going to judge those who have oppressed Israel.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2018 Reply to Peter
51:34 The king of Babylon is being reminded – as are Israel – that the deliverance from Babylon will be like the deliverance from Egypt. “swallowed up” draws on Exo 7:12 and “dragon” draws on “serpent” – Exo 7:9 – it is the same word <8577>
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Peter
OUTLINE OF JEREMIAH
PART THREE -- THE PROPHECIES TO THE GENTILES (Jeremiah 46:1 to 51:64)
IX. Prophecies Against Babylon (Jer.50:1-46 to 51:1-64)
A. Babylon's Destiny (Jer 51:1-64):
1. The Lord's Plan to Punish Babylon (Jer 51:1-19):
a. V1 - Beginning in Genesis 11 and continuing to Revelation 18, Babylon in its various forms is considered at the center of hostility to God; "a destroying wind<7307>" the spirit sent to punish Babylon could be an angel (Psa 104:4) charged with directing the Medes and as we read in V11 "the Lord hath raised up the spirit<7307> of the kings of the Medes".
b. V2 - "fanners<2114>", "fan<2219>", "against<5921>; the NIV reads "foreigners would be sent to Babylon to winnow her and devastate her land"
c. V3 - "Against<413>", "bendeth<1869>", "archer<1869>", "brigandine<5630>".
d. V5 - Israel and Judah not forsaken by God though their land is full of guilt.
e. V6 - God's people were told to flee Babylon and similarly, we are to flee the apostate babel of our modern day spiritual Babylon (Rev 18:4), "his soul<5315>", "render<7999>".
f. V7 - "mad<1984>".
g. VS 8-13 - David Simpson in his 2005 comments notes that the Medes will conquer Babylon and God's people will have the freedom to return to the Promised Land.
h. V9 - Babylon is beyond being healed.
i .V10 - "Zion<6726>".
j. VS 11-14 - Babylon was forced to recognize the power of the Medes and in 585BC accepted the truce between Media and Lydia fixing their respective boundaries and Cyrus the Persian seized power circa 550BC; in V11 the Medes stirred up by God will destroy Babylon.
k. V12 - "watchmen<8104>" does not refer here to look outs protecting the city but rather those blockading.
l. V13 - Babylon dwellest upon many waters (can refer to waters for irrigation but also peoples Rev 17:15-18).
m. VS 15-19 - Babylon's idols were impotent to save her as they had no breath in them; how foolish they were to put trust in such objects created by man, that said, we too can have our own idols that can draw us away from God such as TV, the internet, smart phones, the love of money which can lead to excessive shopping, and various hobbies that can eat up our time that could be devoted to serving God.
n. V17 - "confounded<3001>".
o. V18 - ""vanity<1892>".
Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Charles
OUTLINE OF JEREMIAH
2. The Hammer of God (Jer 51:19-23): Perhaps the war club is Cyrus on behalf of Israel though previously it was Assyria, and then Babylon used as punishing instruments in God's hands. In the future it will Christ who rules from Mount Zion with an iron scepter (Psa 2:6-9).
3. Babylon desolate (Jer 51:24-33):
a. V24 - though Babylon was used by God to punish God's people, the destruction of Babylon was largely because of their destruction of the temple in Zion.
b. VS 25-26 - in addition to destroying God's temple, Babylon is seen as a mountain injurious to all nations and thus an additional reason for its permanent desolation, though it would spiritually reappear in another form in the book of Revelation.
c. VS 11, 27-28 - the Medes would lead a great collection of subject nations to conquer Babylon.
d. V31 - "One post
e. V33 - before actual threshing can start the earth (in this case Babylon) has to be beaten down firmly.
4. Babylon judged (Jer 51:34-40):
a. V34 - "dragon<8577>
b. VS 34-40 - Zion states her case in Vs 34-35 and then God makes her case His own against Babylon.
c. VS 36-37 - the sea perhaps meant the great lake dug by Nitocris to receive the waters of the Euphrates; Cyrus' engineers diverted the waters of the Euphrates so the Median host easily could march into Babylon.
d. V37 - Babylon to be ruined and not to have an inhabitant.
e. V39 - no resurrection or immortality for the irresponsible man (Dan 12:2;1Cor 15:51-52) and the ultimate punishment for sin is the unconsciousness of death (Rom 6:23) without the hope of resurrection and eternal life on earth (Matt 5:5;Matt 6:10).
5. a lament for Babylon (Jer 51:41-44):
a. V41 - "Sheshach
b. V42 - perhaps "The sea" is the Median host army.
c. V44 - "Bel
Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Charles
OUTLINE OF JEREMIAH
6. Judgment and its effects (Jer 51:45-53):
a. V45 and Rev 18:4 - fleeing literal and apostate spiritual Babylon as Michael Parry notes in his 2007 comments.
b. VS 45-53 - God's people should have no place in proud doomed Babylon.
c. V47 - "confounded<954>"
d. V49 - Babylon must fall because of Israel's slain.
e. VS 50-51 - the name of the Lord had no visual vindication.
f. VS 51-53 - Babylon is powerless against her foe due to her sacrilege.
g. V53 - an echo of the famous builders of the tower in Genesis 11.
7. the fall of Babylon (Jer 51:54-58):
a. Babylon was conquered circa 539BC and its 25 foot wide walls were destroyed by Xerxes circa 485BC.
b. V57 - regarding Babylon's officials - "they will sleep forever and not awake" (NIV).
8. the doom of Babylon was prophesied and to be illustrated as sinking like a stone in a separate book which was sent to Babylon 7 years before Nebuchadnezzar burned Jerusalem (Jer 51:59-64):
a. Was Seraiah Baruch's brother (Jer 32:12)?
b. V59 - Zedekiah goes to Babylon with tribute and to convey his second and final letter to the Jews there.
c. V59 - "Seraiah<8304>", "Neriah<5374>", "Maaseiah<4271>", "Zedekiah<6667>"
d. VS 60-62 - Jeremiah had prophesied Babylon would be victorious over Jerusalem and was treated well by the Babylonians (Jer 40:4), but the captive Jews in Babylon were to pronounce the destruction of Babylon, the capital city of their captors.
e. VS 63-64 refers to a book with a stone bound to it thrown into the Euphrates and thus would Babylon sink, and then we see a possible latter day connection in Rev 18:21.
f. Isaiah prophecied circa 760 to 698 BC. Isaiah prophecied that the Medes would render Babylon uninhabitable (Isa 13:1,17-20). But it was Sennacherib of Assyria who captured and destroyed Babylon circa 689 BC.Was Isaiah's inspired prophecy to be proven false? No, for God would never let that happen. Babylon was rebuilt and in 626 BC successfully rebelled against Assyria. Circa 559 BC Cyrus became king over Persia, a region under the rule of Media. Then circa 550 BC Cyrus became king of Media. Circa 539 BC the soldiers of Cyrus took Babylon during a feast and after diverting the protective waters of Babylon they simply marched into the city. Circa 485 BC Babylon rebelled against the Medo-Persians and Xerxes retook the city.
Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Charles
51:51-52 The Jews express their sorrow at their dilemma and so God responds advising Israel that the idol worshippers in Babylon will be judged.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2020 Reply to Peter
51:45 These words from Jeremiah were spoken to the Jews in Babylon many years before Cyrus allowed the Jews to return to the land of Israel after the 70 ear long captivity. But the message was clear. When you have an opportunity to leave Babylon then leave. Sadly in the days of Ezra when the time came there were many who were so comfortable in Babylon that they did not want to leave. Will we be so reluctant to leave behind all our “creature comforts” when Christ returns?
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2021 Reply to Peter
51:6 The captivity had been long. Jeremiah had told the people to lead a settled life in Babylon – Jer 29:28 – The captivity might have caused some to see Babylon as their permanent home. They may have developed a settled comfortable life in Babylon. From such a position maybe even so comfortable that the idea of returning to Judah was the last thing on their minds. Indeed the book of Ezra indicates, at least by implication, that many preferred Babylon to the prospect of living in the land of Israel.
How settled are we in our comfortable lives here? Or are we ready to “flee out of the midst” of that comfortable living?
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2022 Reply to Peter
The LORD is the God of recompense
Here is a characteristic of the LORD God that we have perhaps noticed, but now see it written down for the first time:
... for the LORD God of recompences shall surely requite. (Jer 51:56 KJV)
The New King James Version has it:
... For the LORD is the God of recompense, He will surely repay. (Jer 51:56 NKJV)
The LORD is the God of recompense, and because this is so, He cannot allow the nation of Babylon to spoil His Holy Temple and get away with it un-punished:
"And I will repay Babylon And all the inhabitants of Chaldea For all the evil they have done In Zion in your sight," says the LORD. (Jer 51:24 NKJV)
This characteristic of God is unchangeable, as all of his characteristics are. It is there from the beginning:
To me belongeth vengeance, and recompense; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste. (Deu 32:35 KJV)
And it is there at the end:
For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (Heb 10:30-31 KJV)
Babylon had done something terrible against God and His people, and in God's righteousness, it meant that they would be guilty for it. In the words of the people of Jerusalem, "let my blood be upon the inhabitants of Chaldea":
Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon hath devoured me, he hath crushed me, he hath made me an empty vessel, he hath swallowed me up like a dragon, he hath filled his belly with my delicates, he hath cast me out. The violence done to me and to my flesh be upon Babylon, shall the inhabitant of Zion say; and my blood upon the inhabitants of Chaldea, shall Jerusalem say. (Jer 51:34-35 KJV)
The rest of the chapter details the destruction that would come upon Babylon by the Medes. God would raise up that nation and bring it to prominence in order to carry out His vengeance:
Make bright the arrows; gather the shields: the LORD hath raised up the spirit of the kings of the Medes: for his device is against Babylon, to destroy it; because it is the vengeance of the LORD, the vengeance of his temple. (Jer 51:11 KJV)
The lesson for us is that we need to remember that our God is the same now as He has always been. The New Testament quotations of these verses are all in the context of God judging His own people, and used to show us that we should not turn away from God once we have become His people:
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense... (Heb 10:26-30 KJV)
Rob de Jongh [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Rob
51:56 The language “the king whose name is the Lord of hosts” is found three times in Jer 46:18, 48:15, 51:57 – which seems to draw on the earlier prophet – Amos 5:27. The majesty of God is here used to speak of the certainty of the judgments that were to come.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Peter
51:8 It is true that Babylon was “suddenly” destroyed. There was no long siege. Babylon was overthrown in one night – the night of Belshazzar’s feast Dan 5:30-31
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2024 Reply to Peter
v. 3 Christ the head - a very common theme in the New Testament letters. It must be a good thing for us to contemplate. Christ the head - that means we must try to live and govern ourselves and our ecclesias only as he would have done - quite a responsibility. Eph.1:22-23 4:15 5:23 Phil.2:10,11 Col.1:18 2:10,19.
Peter [UK] Comment added in 2001 Reply to Peter
v.23 In introducing the breaking of bread with 'the same night in which he was betrayed ...' Paul is forcing the Corinthians to reflect on the way in which Judas thought at the last supper. He had another agenda. He wanted to betray Jesus for the pieces of silver John 13:30. The Corinthians were behaving in a similar manner because their minds were on the feast they were having. How do we fare? Are our minds 'somewhere else'?
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2001 Reply to Peter
The issue of the wearing of coverings is dealt with by the use of Old Testament Scriptures.
Image
|
Gen 1:26 | |
Glory
|
Gen 8:5 | |
woman of the man
|
Gen 2:23 | |
the woman for the man
|
Gen 2:18 |
So whatever we think about the issue it is clear that it has fundamental principles behind it which are lodged right back in Genesis in the creation of Eve.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2002 Reply to Peter
:30 In that many were 'weak and sickly' in Corinth because they did not 'discern the Lord's body' is a powerful warning. The divisive nature of the behaviour of some in the ecclesia had an unhealthy effect upon the 'body' - the whole family of God. Maybe this is one reason why God hates the one who sows discord (Proverbs 6:19)
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2003 Reply to Peter
Why does Paul talk about illness and death in v30? What does he mean in this context? Is he talking about "spiritual" sleep and death, or physical?
- The believers at Corinth had been holding the breaking of bread service completely wrong (v18-22).
- Paul tells them that this service is in fact the partaking of the body and blood of Christ (v23-26).
- He makes the logical step, that if they do it unworthily, then they will be guilty of that body and blood (v27 see also Hebrews 10v29).
- If one is guilty of the body and blood of Christ, then he will bring judgment upon himself (v29).
- In order to turn them away from them doing this, God has been afflicting them (v30)
- This is chastening from God, rather than condemnation (v32)
The advice of Paul is in v31. If they would judge themselves, and turn away from their evil practices, then God would not have to judge them himself. This way they would avoid the chastening described in v30.
Rob de Jongh [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2003 Reply to Rob
11:1 Paul is not setting himself up as some ideal, Like as in 4:16 Paul is trying to set a standard of personal behaviour. In calling upon the brethren to imitate him as he does Christ he is challenging them to think whether they could make the same appeal to their brethren.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to Peter
11:24: The KJV says".....Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you:.... note the verb "eat" is attached to the noun "body". One must take care so as not to assume -it is the Lord Jesus' body which is broken (see John 19:36: "....a bone of him shall not be broken".) It is necessary in one's prayers to resist the temptation to say: His body broken for us. Further conformation of what is being referred to in 11:24 is to read the same verse in the Hebrew Bible. Here the verb is "cut or divided" and is in the correct place, next to the noun "bread".
Beryl Butler [London West (Can)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to Beryl
V.34 The Corinthians must accept this letter as a reply to the more pressing issues. No immediate need was seen to visit the ecclesia; a visit by Timothy would have to suffice 1Cor 4:18, 1Cor 16:10. As time passed, deteriorating conditions at Corinth required Paul to alter his plans and pay a humiliating visit to the ecclesia 2Cor 1:23-24, 2Cor 2:1, 2Cor 13:2.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)] Comment added in 2004 Reply to John
11:9 In saying that the woman was made ‘for the man’ Paul is not advocating that the wife is the servant of the husband. He is laying out the respective status of both in the partnership. As Scripture says Eve was a ‘help’ Gen 2:18 – the first use of ‘help’ in Scripture!
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2006 Reply to Peter
FOLLOW MY EXAMPLE
"Follow my example as I follow the example of Christ." (1Cor 11:1)
As we read through the life of Paul through the Acts of the Apostles, we discover a man whose devotion to the Lord stands out from the crowd. In both the story of his life and in his letters, we can be inspired to be like him and motivated to give our all for Christ. Paul's reason to live was to be a servant of Christ. His mission was to show the love of Christ to others and to teach them of his saving grace. Paul did whatever it took to encourage anyone he could to accept the gospel message and to choose life. The life of Paul was a great example to those of us who have followed since. They way he followed Christ pointed others to follow in the same way.
What sort of inspiration does our life provide for the people who see us? Can we say, like Paul did, "Follow my example as I follow the example of Christ"? For many people our example may be the only vision of Christ they will ever see. Let's not let them down but become the motivation for them to seek out the Lord Jesus Christ themselves.
Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)] Comment added in 2006 Reply to Robert
11:25-27 Notice the repeated use of ‘cup’ when speaking of the breaking of bread. This is consistent with Jesus’ use in the gospels. He always speaks of the ‘cup’. The cup in Scripture has particular significance. It can be a cup of blessing or a cup of cursing. In the context of breaking bread it all depends on the attitude of the partaker.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to Peter
V.3 True worship needs to take into account the hierarchy that has been set in place since creation.
Under the New Covenant, the sequence in Christ's household is:
God ----> Jesus ----> Man ----> Woman.
Vs.4,5 To reflect this hierarchy, men should worship with uncovered heads, while women should cover their heads. Believers should not rebel against this ordinance in name of feminism.
V.10 Because each true believer is accompanied by a ministering angel (Heb 1:14), all worship is done in the presence of angels.
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2007 Reply to Michael
11:8 Notice how the ordering of the creation of Adam and then the formation of Eve is actually used to make a principle – such is the importance of the details in Scripture. We should take heed in our own Bible study to be careful to note what the text says and use the detail to grow our understanding of it.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2008 Reply to Peter
11:2,17,22 The repeated use of ‘praise’ and ‘praise you not’ provides a very simple way of marking the distinction between what was and what was not acceptable in the way that the Corinthians were doing. It was a most appropriate way to write given the factious nature of Corinth and the way that leaders had set themselves up who clearly loved the ‘praise of men’.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Peter
V.13 The word for uncovered is akatakaluptos which is the exact opposite of katakalupto, which means completely covered (v.6).
V.15 Some contend that this verse suggests long hair is a sufficient covering for a woman. However, Paul is just contrasting the acceptable state of hair for a man and woman in vs.14 and 15.
The word covering comes from the Gr. peribolaion which describes something loosely thrown around, like a cloak. Thus, long hair is becoming for a woman. However, the word used for covered in v.6, comes from the Gr. katakalupto which means fully covered.
Paul is saying that a woman’s head should not only be covered, but completely covered, hair and all. This should give pause to those women who think it acceptable to throw on a hankie-sized piece of headgear.
V.16 We have no such custom (KJV) is Paul's plain retort to the contentious individual who espouses the idea that it is all right for men to have long hair; for women to pray or prophesy (engage in acts of worship) with their heads uncovered; or for men's heads to be covered while worshipping.
V.24 Broken (KJV) refers to the bread and not to Jesus’ body, which was not broken. This is because no bone of the Pascal Lamb, which represented Jesus, should be broken (Exo 12:46; John 19:36).
Some manuscripts do not have the word broken, and most modern versions render Jesus’ statement as: "This is my body which is for you. Do this in remembrance of me." (ESV).
Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)] Comment added in 2009 Reply to Michael
11:18 ‘in the church’ seems to be a specialised phrase and does not just mean when the believers met together. Rather it specifically speaks of the time when they met to remember the lord’s death in the taking of the bread and the wine
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2010 Reply to Peter
This passage about head coverings is hard to understand and quite ambiguous. That's why it's hard to gain consensus. Paul says that in cases where the issue becomes contentious, he suggests we adopt "no such practice" (v16). It is clear from the context that he means the practice of a woman praying or prophesying with her head uncovered.
Rob de Jongh [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2010 Reply to Rob
11:11-12 Here we see the correct Scriptural balance. Both man and woman are complementary. They assist each other. As Genesis says eve was a support for Adam – Gen 2:18
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2011 Reply to Peter
“But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head… For this cause ought the woman to have a sign of power (sign of authority) on her head because of the angels.”
It is sometimes argued that this is the only passage that commands women to wear a head covering. How many times does God have to give the same command, especially when the principle is interwoven throughout Scripture? When God spoke, it was done (Gen 1)! Another argument is that this command applied only to the Corinthian Ecclesia, and not applicable to us. It is spiritually dangerous for us to ignore a passage of Scripture and say it does not apply to us. Indeed, 1Cor 1:2 tells us otherwise!
Paul is speaking of wearing a head covering that completely covers the hair as a sign of a woman's subjection to man. The verbs, “covered” and "cover" are katakalupto, <2619>, and occur three times in 1Cor 11:6-7. Since the word means, “to cover wholly… hide,” the text is referring to a hair covering of some kind, like an opaque veil, that hides the hair, and certainly does not describe a lace doily or hat perched on a sister’s head that does not hide the hair.
Why “because of the angels”? These Elohim, or God’s angels, were not human, but spiritual messengers. It is these Elohim who, by the power of God’s Holy Spirit, did all the creation work. They did not co-create the man and woman; there was a sequence, a chronological order as well as an order in terms of purpose and design. Man was created first as ordained by God, Himself. The wife was to be a companion and helper to her husband. This is why Paul refers us back to the origin of Adam and Eve in the context of 1Cor 11. These events pre-dated the fall of Adam and Eve and God’s subsequent curse upon creation.
Though a head covering does not trace its origin to creation since Adam and Eve were both naked, the principle of male headship does, and this is Paul’s point. It was not because Eve was deceived into sinning that she was made subject to her husband, but because she was created from Adam and for Adam by the angels (Gen 2:18-24).
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2011 Reply to Valerie
“Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him? But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.”
The Apostle Paul uses the analogy of nature because it does not rely on changeable customs. A woman wearing a head covering acknowledged the fact, then and now, that she is under man’s authority and not to claim her own.
A lot of unnecessary confusion has originated from this verse, in that some conclude that this must mean long hair is in lieu of a head covering. The Greek word here for “covering” is, peribolaion, # <4018>, and literally means, “something thrown around one”. The only other place this word is used is in Heb 1:12, where it says, "And as a vesture (peribolaion) shalt thou fold them up...” The verb form of the word, periballo, found about 23 times, almost always refers to being covered with a robe cast around oneself. This is a completely different word than, katakalupto, # <2619>, mentioned in verses 5-7,13, for something wholly hidden.
According to the literal meanings of the original Greek terms, the woman's hair, which is her glory and serves as her natural covering, is to be cast around, which is the definition of the word, peribolaion, in verse 15. The word, katakalupto, means something that covers completely and hangs down. The picture one can easily visualize here is that a woman put her hair up (cast or wrapped around) in such a way that her opaque veil can cover it, for the sign is the covered head, not just the covering itself, and it is meant to cover her own glory which, in part, is her hair.
Handkerchiefs, or frilly, see-through doilies seem to serve more to draw attention to the hair underneath, and is a feminine supplanter of the sign of subjection as designed by God.
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2011 Reply to Valerie
11:19 Paul’s comment about the fact that there will be “heresies” is not to be taken as a reason for apathy about problems. Rather it should make us realise that it is in the dealing with, Scripturally, these “heresies” that we grow to be more like Jesus. It is the thinking about how to behave that causes us to grow to be more like Jesus.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2013 Reply to Peter
11:31 Paul is not suggesting that our own view of ourselves will be the way that God will judge us at the judgement seat of Christ. Rather he is saying that if we sort our own lives out now so that your brethren cannot fault our actions then they will not be in a position to point the accusing finger at us. It would appear that in Corinth this was a real issue that had to be addressed. This is what is behind Paul’s comment in verse :34.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2014 Reply to Peter
11:6 The “shame” associated with the shaving of the head draws on the defilement of the Nazarite whose vow was made void by toughing a dead body – Num 6:6
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2015 Reply to Peter
“After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord’s death till he come.”
A reader writes: “… the wine is the drink offering poured out with the burnt offering, as per Numbers 28, which contributes to the 'sweet savour ' to the Lord. It is not poured out in the Holy Place, but on the brazen altar in the court. There must have been a fair quantity of wine, so whether it was kept on or near the table of shewbread we don't know. Its just that the flagons etc were on the table. Num 15:10 also refers...”
My reply: Scripture does not say wine was on the table of showbread. The “Holy Place,” as read in Num 28:7 is the Outer Court. Holy has a variety of applications and in context here, it does not apply to the Holy Place. Place was incorrectly added. Holy here refers to something that is dedicated to Yahweh, and is the Hebrew word, qodesh. The Drink Offering was an altar offering in its own right, a natural affinity with the meal offering as the bread and wine of Yahweh’s table (cf. Exo 29:38-41; Num 15:1-12; Eze 45:17). This took place in the Outer Court! (cf. Num 6:15 cp. 2Kin 16:13).
Flagons were on the table, they were flagons of oil. Reading Num 15:10 on, it clearly shows us where the wine was. We cannot conclude from this that wine was put near or on the table of shewbread. The wine was consumed for the sacrifices, Yahweh specifically gave the amounts for each of the sacrifices, and in this you are right, that it would be a lot of wine, but the amount used varied in proportion to the size and kind of the animal sacrifice (cf. Num 15). Again, we cannot conclude that any leftover wine was brought to the Holy Place. We cannot cite a Scripture that tells us specifically wine was on the table of shewbread. It is merely an assumption based on the Memorial service as given to us by Christ.
What it does show is that Christ’s blood was shed “without the camp,” and his body "broken" (not literal, though), as it was with the sacrificial animals, "without the camp" (Heb 11:11-13). The wine for the sacrifices were consumed on the altar and with the sacrifices made it a “sweet smelling savour” in the Outer Court in this particular instance (cf. Eph 5:2). Nowhere does Scripture tell us about actual wine being brought into the Holy Place, let alone for the priests to drink or do anything with it in there. Everything God ordained has meaning and purpose. What meaning or purpose would flagons of wine on the table of showbread serve? We do know what the flagons of oil served. Since every item in the Holy Place was specifically identified and priests told what to do, why is the wine kept out? It is wrong to assume wine had to be there to fit our Memorial service. Some writers do not mention anything here about flagons of oil when Scripture plainly says there was oil on the table of showbread in the Holy Place - and lots of it! It was a hin of oil, or four quarts (3.75 liters), (cf. Exo 30:24). We know how Yahweh expected His ordinances to be followed to the T, and there is no way if there was a specific procedure or reason for the wine in the Holy Place, that it would not be recorded. We wouldn’t have to assume there was wine on the Table of Shewbread, for which we have no explanation for, only that it “fits” our Memorial Breaking of Bread service, so we make it so. Just because the majority books make it so, does not mean it is so.
Wine was a cleansing agent and Christ’s blood, which the wine typified, cleanses us in the waters of baptism. Why was wine excluded from the Holy Place and Most Holy Place? Because, the fullness of the kingdom had not yet come in the Old Covenant. The priestly work was not yet finished. The Old Covenant priests could not rest from their priestly labours. The priests reminded the people that the final form of the kingdom had not yet come. The blood of bulls and goats never took away sin (Heb 10:4). Only with the priestly work of Jesus do the people of God enjoy the Sabbath rest associated with the completed work of Christ. The Old Covenant priests had to offer sacrifices continually and could not rest from doing so. They might not drink wine or strong drink in the tabernacle of the congregation or inner court (Lev 10:9; Eze 44:21). Furthermore, Jesus refused the wine when He was performing His high priestly service on his crucifixion stake (Mark 15:23). He did, however, drink wine with His disciples just prior to his arrest in Gethsemane and will again (Matt 26:29; Mark 14:25; Luke 22:18). Now that Jesus has completed his priestly work once and for all, he sits at the Father’s right hand, resting from his work and inviting his bride into his presence to participate in his joyous and festive rest by partaking of the bread and wine. The dinner table that Jesus spreads before his saints and at which he officiates is a table of thanksgiving and rest, a covenantal Memorial Meeting of his finished work (1Cor 11:25,26). The New Covenant believers in Christ have full access to God’s Holy presence and they can joyfully rest in His presence by partaking of the bread and drinking the wine, something which the Israelites did not have and were forbidden to do.
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2015 Reply to Valerie
11:12 It seems that the way a woman might “pray or prophesy” with her head uncovered draws on the trial of jealousy – Num 5:18.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2016 Reply to Peter
11:20-21 Doubtless the Corinthians thought that they were meeting to remember the death of Jesus in the “lord’s supper” however their mental state meant that God did not recognise what they were doing as what Jesus had instituted. Rather like Israel in the wilderness who, as far as God was concerned, were not transporting His tabernacle but rather things associated with worship of a false god –Amos 5:26.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2017 Reply to Peter
"For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels."
There is an ellipsis in the wording of 1 Cor. xi, 10, which, when supplied, removes the obscurity. Read 'appointment of the,' before 'angels,' and you have Paul's idea. The question was the position of woman as indicated by a covered head. Paul goes back to the beginning. 'Neither was the man created for the woman, but the woman for the man. For this cause ought the woman to have power (that is protection) on her head because of (the appointment) the angels.' The angels settled these things in the beginning, and human custom ought to be accommodated to their appointment." Robert Roberts, Christadelphian, 1898, p. 293
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2017 Reply to Valerie
“After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying. This cup is the new testament in my blood…”
Paul told the Corinthian ecclesia that Christ is the Passover sacrificed for us (1Cor 5:7).
The word “cup” is a metonymy, meaning that the cup represents what it contains. Here it is wine. The wine symbolized Christ’s blood, thus, the New Covenant, a contract, or agreement in his blood, ratifies and binds our relationship to him (cf. Luke 22:20. By the shedding of his blood, he did away with the Old Covenant requirement for continual animal sacrifices (Heb 10:3-29; 1Pet 1:19). No further sacrifices were needed and while dying, he said, “It is finished.” His entire work of redemption was complete (Heb 9:12).
The blood of Christ has its origin in the Mosaic Law (Heb 7:27; Heb 9:22). Wine was offered with the morning and evening sacrifices as a drink offering (Exo 29:38-40; Num 15:5,7,10; Num 28:14. Wine was also part of the wave sheaf offering (Lev 23:13. Wine was used during the Feasts (Deut 16:13). Wine in these cited passages is the Hebrew word, yayin, # <3196>, “… to effervesce; wine (as fermented); by impl. intoxication…”
The first time we read about bread and wine is read in Gen 14:18,19 and referenced in Heb 7:1-18. Christ, a High Priest after the order of Melchizedek, used covenant language when he introduced our Memorial Service of bread and wine until he returns. The cup the Lord took contained fermented wine and not grape juice.
“… As for wine, you cannot have wine without fermentation. A rabid teetotalism is responsible for a good deal of fog on this question. Grape juice is one thing; wine is another. Men may agree to call the former wine, but it is not the thing that has for ages been known as wine. Bible wine is grape juice in the vinous state, in which there has been that amount of fermentation of the saccharine matter that imparts to it the heart-gladdening power of which David speaks.” Robert Roberts, Christadelphian, 1890, p. 219. (Emphasis added).
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2017 Reply to Valerie
11:23-26 Paul quotes extensively from the gospel records when he speaks of the breaking of bread
:23 took bread |
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:24 And when he had given thanks, |
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:24 he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, |
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:24 which is broken for you: |
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:24 this do in remembrance of me. |
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:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, |
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:25 This cup is the new testament in my blood: |
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:25 in remembrance of me. |
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2018 Reply to Peter
11:10 Whilst “because of the angels” is difficult to understand we have an example – Ecc 5:6–where behaviour is linked with angels observing.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Peter
“For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.” RSV
“When Paul in 1Cor 11:30 says, ‘For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep,” he undoubtedly refers to physical suffering. The connection shows this former [v. 29]. ‘He that eateth and drinketh (the memorial bread and wine) unworthily, eateth and drinketh DAMNATION (or judgment) to himself.’ That is because of their unworthy use of the Lord’s ordinances, they were suffering judgment. This was punishment beforehand, that the punishment of the second-death, at the Lord’s coming, might be averted; as is evident from the succeeding words [v. 31]; ‘When we are (thus) judged, we are CHASTENED OF THE LORD that we should not be condemned with the world.’
The ministration of the Spirit, and, therefore, experienced the results of their actions in a more direct and signal manner than is permitted to us in these deserted days. Nevertheless, we are under the same Lord, and may trust to receive a portion of that chastisement which will redeem us from the fate of bastards.” [Heb 12:7,8]
Brother Robert Roberts, Christadelphian, p. 436, 1898
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Valerie
“For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.”
MEDITATIONS—NO. 35, An Ominous Sign, by Brother A.T. Jannaway, 1927
“‘I FEEL that a great division is approaching,’ said brother Roberts many years since. When he was asked over what, his answer was, ‘The commandments of Christ.’ Our brother had noticed in various influential quarters a growing disposition to set these commandments at naught, and he felt that the time was nearing when it would be necessary for rightminded brethren to take a stand, and refuse to be compromised. Brother Roberts was mistaken, not as to the division, for that came right enough, but as to the ostensible cause of it. The division took place, but over another matter altogether—over a question of doctrine. It is here where the lesson lies. It was first un-Christlike walk, then increasing unfriendliness towards those who dutifully reproved and rebuked, then a siding with heresy, or those who promulgated it, then separation. Now the working of all this is very easy to fathom. Unworthy men who want, wholly or partly, to shake off the restraints of the Truth seldom say so openly, but invent the plea of divergence on doctrine. This is where unfaithful brethren add sin to sin.”
“Must” is the Greek word, dei, # <1163>, and according to STRONG’s Concordance, by adding “should,” it takes away the forceful meaning, as intended by Paul. Rather, it leaves us with the idea, “we should, but…” like we have an option, and, therefore, could be misleading. “Must be” is an imperative verb, “it is necessary,” “there is need of,” “it behooves,” “is right and proper” – THE NEW THAYER’s GREEK-ENGLISH LEXICON, p. 126, # 63. It is the same word Christ used in John 3:7, “you must be (dei) born again.” “they that worship God, must (dei) worship him in spirit and in truth” (John 4:24), “What must (dei) I do to be saved (Acts 16:30)?”
It is a moral obligation to withdraw ourselves from heretics because they “must be” among us for a specific reason, and that is to manifest the true and approved. To be passive, condoning, and compromising for the sake of peace and unity is unscriptural. By remaining steadfast, we maintain the Truth, preserve the Truth, the whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth. We must (dei) stand true and firm to God and His Word, and He will do the rest.
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Valerie
“BE ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.”
IN WHAT SENSE IS DR. THOMAS FOLLOWED
“We follow Dr. Thomas in the sense in which Paul asked the Corinthian believers to follow him, not for what he was as a natural man, but for the treasure of heaven which the earthen vessel contained; Paul got the treasure by inspiration; Dr. Thomas by a life-long study of what inspiration wrote. The result is the same, except as to authority, which Dr. Thomas was the last to claim. Dr. Thomas gave reasons for all he taught. We have looked at those reasons, and considering them good, adopt his conclusions. Surely this is as legitimate as your rejection of some of them. Judge us not. The Lord is Judge, at which we rejoice. Take care that ye speak no evil of the things ye understand not.”
Brother Robert Roberts, Christadelphian, 1872, p. 136
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Valerie
“For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.”
A brOTHER’S EXPERIENCE
“We have never known a hearty friend of God wince at anything sincerely said or done in His defence. Even in human polemics, blows struck in any cause give satisfaction to those who are hearty in that cause. Indiscretion is borne with: ay, faults overlooked—when the attack is sympathized with. Everything depends upon where man’s loves be: if, like Peter, ‘he savour the things that be of men,’ he is pained and shocked at everything that jars on human dignities. If, like Phineas or Elijah, he is ‘zealous for the Lord God of hosts’ (Num 25:11; 1Kin 19:10,14), he easily and gladly lends himself to measures which, in our day, are considered the excess of barbarity. The want of enlightened sympathy with God’s objects in the creation of man, and God’s purpose in His present dealings with him, is the explanation of many a ‘fraternal’ hitch. Men come into the truth with but a feeble affinity for it, while having a strong regard for their own importance and the susceptibilities of Gentile rebels of all kinds. The consequence is manifest sooner or later in their antipathies to sound doctrine and faithful action, which cause trouble; well, it is part of the providence of God, with objects defined in advance (1Cor 11:19), but which will not be thoroughly manifest till the day of final results.”
Brother Robert Roberts
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2019 Reply to Valerie
11:18 “When ye be come together” is a specific comment about when the believers meet to remember Jesus in bread and wine. We see that the party spirit “I am of …” is seen even when remembering Jesus. Such things should not be so.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2020 Reply to Peter
11:5 Paul’s teaching on head coverings is based fundamentally on the relationship established after Adam and eve’s sin. It is not based on any social customs of the day. Nor should social customs of today be used as a basis for varying what God set out as a fundamental principle when sin entered the world.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2021 Reply to Peter
“For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.”
“When we are at meeting surely our angels are there also (Psa 34:7). Since there was one particular angel (besides the angels of the true believers) with ‘the ecclesia in the wilderness’ which was Israel, one angel who especially represented the presence of God (Isa 63:9) may there not be likewise at our meetings one angel, besides our individual angels, who represents the present of Christ? These Angels of the Presence would surely be especially offended by the presence of bare-headed sisters and grieved by their lack of understanding.”
A Sister’s Place in the Family of God, by Sisters Dorrie Dillingham, Lois Riley, p. 20
The apostle Paul, in drawing upon the order of “headship,” reinforced the integrity of this order on account of the angels having mediatory roles with God (Acts 7:53; Gal 3:19,20; Heb 2:2; Rev 1:1). The head covering of a woman is a sign of the man’s authority over her, and this originated from God (Gen 3:16) and mediated by the angels for us. Therefore, the manner of the integrity of the order as given by Yahweh and mediated to us by the angels, is, as Paul points out, must be maintained.
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2021 Reply to Valerie
“After the same manner also, he took the cup, after supper, saying, This cup is the new covenant in my blood: this do as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.”
In Biblical times when a man wanted to marry, the father would present to the father of the potential bride the betrothal contract, legally binding, that specified the terms of the marriage, the chief among the terms being the price the groom was willing to pay for his bride. In Hebrew, it is referred to as the Ketubah. After the price was accepted, the father of the groom would hand his son a cup of wine, and after he drank from it, he offered it to his potential bride. In essence in doing this, he was saying, “I love you; will you marry me?” If she partook of the wine, she accepted the proposal and sealed their engagement. The groom would then leave to prepare a place for them to live, referred to as the Chuppah, which usually took around a year. This interim was the Kiddushin. If during the Kiddushin the Ketubah is violated, the betrothal contract becomes null and void.
When Jesus took the cup of wine and drank from it, he then offered it to his disciples. In essence, he was saying “I love you, the price I pay is my life; will you marry me?” This was a betrothal, between Jesus, the bridegroom, and his ecclesia, the bride (cf. 2Cor 11:2). Every time we partake of the Memorial emblems and drink from the cup, we are saying to Jesus, "I love you, I accept your gift of life, and give my life to you in return” (Rom 12:1,2). Jesus paid the highest price to purchase his bride, and has left to prepare a place for us, (John 14:2,3). During this Kiddushin period, we are to love one another, as Jesus loved us (John 13:34). Jesus showed us what the foundation of any successful marriage would be.
Our love for one another must be based on the love Christ demonstrated for us, and no other kind of love will keep us in him (1John 3:16-20). Christ did not just say he loves us, he demonstrated it. Spiritual health, oneness, selflessness, and sacrifice are what solidify a marriage that honours God. It is to offer God honour of the highest respect, reverence, admiration, praise, submission and obedience, which are due to Him. Jesus commands us to honour God with both our lips and our hearts (Matt 22:37,38). Anything short of this is mere hypocrisy (Matt 15:7-9), and the Ketubah (baptism), and the Kiddushin (interim), being our time between baptism and Christ’s return, will be made null and void!
Christ has shown us, “the way” (John 14:6), and we must use this interim period to honour our baptismal vows and strive as best we can to make ourselves ready for the bridegroom, that we may partake of the marriage supper of the Lamb, our Groom (Rev 19:7-9).
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2021 Reply to Valerie
SO THANKFUL!
Giving thanks is a very important part of our Christian life. Every day should be a day of thanks. Paul tells us to "give thanks in all circumstances, for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you." (1Thess 5:18).
The day and time we come to remember our Lord Jesus Christ in bread and wine should be our most thankful time of all. Here we remember the perfect life our Lord lived, we remember his great sacrifice for us, the incredible blessing of forgiveness we have been given through him, his resurrection, and the hope of our own resurrections to eternal life. Along with all that, we usually remember him in fellowship together with other brothers and sisters. The things we should be thankful about go on and on...
It's in remembering him that he says,"Do this in remembrance of me." (1Cor 11:24). Jesus had taken the bread and given thanks. There are times for prayers of petition, but this is a time of thankfulness, just as Jesus showed us. Let's raise our hearts and hands in thankfulness when we share the bread and wine together in remembrance of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)] Comment added in 2021 Reply to Robert
11:5 When a woman was accused of infidelity towards her husband she had to uncover her head – Num 5:18 – In like manner Paul is showing that any female believer who prays (doubtless in the company of other male believers) is showing disrespect for Christ.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2022 Reply to Peter
DISCERN THE BODY
We sit there on a Sunday morning and take bread and wine in remembrance of our Lord Jesus Christ. We try to do it in a way that is worthy of his sacrifice as we remember his life, death and resurrection, his body and blood. But when the Corinthians are reprimanded for the way they took bread and drank wine, it was because there were divisions among them.
Some ate and drank whole meals and even got drunk, while others stayed hungry. The believers in Corinth didn't seem to care about each other, so Paul says, "What! Do you not have houses to eat and drink in? Or do you despise the church of God and humiliate those who have nothing?" (1Cor 11:22).
I wonder if this is the context he was speaking in when he said, "For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgement on himself." (v.29). By the body, it seems he is talking about believers making up the body of Christ, a theme he expands on in the following chapter. For that reason, let us grow more aware of our fellow believers as we fellowship together around this memorial meal. Let us live in love, as Christ loved us and gave his body and blood for us.
Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)] Comment added in 2022 Reply to Robert
“BE ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.”
The following is abridged from FURTHER SEASONS OF COMFORT, Paul and True Godliness, Robert Roberts, pp. 100-103. I highly recommend reading his entire exhortation dealing with this particular verse.
The Spirit by Paul says, “’Be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove (or realize in yourselves) what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God’ (Rom 12:2). If Paul lived in all good conscience, it was ‘before God’ (Acts 23:1) … Paul, like the Lord himself, set God always before him. It was the constant vision of his mental man. He is our example… In view of Paul’s habitual recognition of God, it is natural to find that he was a man of prayer (Acts 9:11; Rom 1:9; Eph 6:18; Phil 1:4; Col 1:3; 1Thess 3:10…).’
When Paul communicated with the brethren, it was with the same spirit of Godliness; his salutations divine (Eph 1:2; 2Cor 1:2; Phil 1:2). Paul was also tender-hearted and moved frequently to tears (Acts 21:13; 2Cor 2:4; Phil 3:18; cp. Heb 5:7). ‘There may be many who are called brethren, through whom the truth is brought into reproach, who conform not at all to the Pauline standard… Wise men will resist the influence of this class, and seek to neutralize it by the exhibition and assertion of the model Christ has given us in Paul…
Summarizing them, we have found a man of good conscience and modest self-estimate; yet of bold self-assertion when necessary; an earnest, ardent, devoted, thorough-going friend and servant of Christ; supremely, yea, exclusively interested in Christ’s affairs on earth, for which he entertained an appreciation amounting to enthusiasm. We have found him a benevolent man, mindful of the needs of others; interested in the brethren; solicitous of their welfare, and compassionate of the poor. We have found him a man of sympathy, of affection, and of tenderness of heart, even to tears. We have found him, above all, a lover of God, a man of prayer, with constant recognition and regard for the will of God in his matters and a constant exemplification of sobriety and godliness.
In these particulars we have a copy set before us by Christ to imitate… is it difficult? … Let us remember that in the Master of the school, we have a merciful and faithful high priest, who knows our infirmities, and will make allowance for our shortcomings, if only we are attentive and diligent scholars…”
Paul was affectionately interested in the brethren, and whatever he did or said, he did knowing that it was all before God. If we constantly have this awareness before us, knowing that God hears and sees it all, it will motivate us to be so much more loving and kinder, especially with those of the household of faith (Gal 6:10). If we do, we would be following Paul’s example, who followed Christ’s example, to which we are invited to follow.
Valerie Mello [in isolation, TN, USA] Comment added in 2022 Reply to Valerie
11:23-25 The repeated use of the Old Testament demonstrated that the Corinthians were expected to know the Old Testament history well. The repeated use of language from the gospel records required that the believers were equally familiar with the gospel records. It seems that the fact that they did not behave appropriately indicates that they gave scant regard to Jesus’ teaching about the “last supper”.
Peter Forbes [Mountsorrel (UK)] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Peter
Bruce Bates [Forbes Australia] Comment added in 2023 Reply to Bruce